SUPREME COURT TO DECIDE “WHO IS A PREACHER?”
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SUPREME COURT TO DECIDE “WHO IS A PREACHER?”
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Who should decide who gets to teach or preach a religion’s doctrines? The faith institution or the government? That question just went before the US Supreme Court.
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The case involves the laying off of a fifth-grade teacher at Our Lady of Guadalupe, a Catholic school in Hermosa Beach, California. The laid-off teacher wants the government to be the final judge. The school insists the government should have no say in the matter.
Courts have already ruled religious bodies alone have the power to decide about the hiring and firing of the clergy. In this case, the school argues religious teachers also minister, so the government should be kept away from their hiring and firing because of that exemption courts have granted.
There’s a Doctrine for That
“The doctrine is the ministerial exception,” Diana Verm, a senior counsel at the Becket Fund for Religious Liberty, told CBN News. “And the question is: does it apply to who teaches religion at religious schools?”
Becket Attorney Eric Rassbach argued the point Monday to the justices not in the Supreme Court chambers, but over the phone. That’s the way the Court is holding hearings due to the coronavirus pandemic.
Speaking of teachers at Our Lady of Guadalupe, Rassbach said, “They were absolutely doing much more than teaching about religion. They were teaching it devotionally. And they were proselytizing. Their job number one and their overriding commitment was to teach these kids to become Catholic and to believe in the Catholic faith.”. . .
Exemption May Protect Religious Employers, but How Many Employees Might it Hurt?
Representing the laid-off teacher, attorney Jeffrey Fisher told the Court, “The school’s argument would strip more than 300,000 lay teachers in religious schools across the country of basic employment law protections.”
Rassbach, the school’s attorney, argued government just should not be allowed to interfere with those who minister faith, including religious teachers. In an earlier brief to the Court, he pointed out how the laid-off teacher, in this case, was like a minister, writing, “She taught daily religion classes covering core Catholic doctrine, the sacraments, and how to read the Bible; she led daily and spontaneous prayers with and for her students…”
His colleague Verm added, “So the question is: is she enough of a minister? And we say, if you’re teaching the faith to children at a religious school and you’re teaching them religion more than they get to spend time with the parish priest, you’re a minister of the faith.”
And so, Verm argued, the Catholic church should be covered by the ministerial exception in its dealing with such teachers.
Why This Should Matter to All Faiths
In a short video, Becket said of the doctrine behind the exception, “Just like the government can’t control what your church teaches, it can’t control who teaches it either. Anything less would violate the constitutional guarantee that ‘government shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.’”
Verm urges all religious believers to be concerned about the fate of the ministerial exception, saying, “The right of religious schools to choose who passes on the faith to the next generation is important to all faiths. And if the government can dictate who teaches the faith, then they can decide what is being taught as well.”
Strict constitutionalists interpret the First Amendment as being all about preventing the government from controlling religion. And they say that’s what’s at stake in this case – keeping the hands of the state off the church.
(Excerpt from CBN News. Article by Paul Strand.)
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GOD HAS THE ONLY AND LAST SAY ABOUT HOW HIS PEOPLE WILL BE POSITIONED AND DISTRIBUTES HIS GIFTS ACCORDINGLY.
LORD HAVE YOUR WILL AND HAVE YOUR WAY WITH THE SUPREME COURT AND LET THEM KNOW WHO IS SUPREME OVER ALL THE EARTH. AMEN
Pastor Regina
All people of faith should be alarmed by this.
This is a California case, and they will do just about anything to kill the Constitution of the United States. No matter what happens the Church or Employer in this case have forced the case to the Supreme Court and not and not for the benefit for the rest of the country. The government can’t get as much as a toehold, we agree, into decisions on defining who is a Minister. This is protected clearly in our Constitution, and they already erred when they took prayer out of school by misinterpreting the clause in the constitution by going to plumb nelly to redefine what was meant by no establishment, and as long we go there in California and several States they are teaching Islam and the Five Pillars of Faith, ut won’t let Christians have a Bible, or pray, say blessing, or even be able to have christian clubs. Dear God God please put your Holy Spirit to work on the hearts and minds of the Supreme Court Justices, and defend the Constitution.
Do not. I repeat. DO NOT ever give the government as much as a toe space to decide who fills a pulpit and who does not. It crosses several amendments to the constitution at once. That decision should be the exclusive decision of the individual faith body.
The believing Church needs to carefully look at this and the implications. There are enough examples of state controlled churches to instruct us on what government-run religion means. The believing Church must not be afraid to open the discussion within, look at the history, and decide whether it will stand or fold. The spiritual war is becoming more and more clear, and will not be denied.
The article is a little confusing to me.
I thought it was decided in our Constitution that we have Freedom of Religion.
I am not clear on why she is going before the Supreme Court.
Can you clarify Please so I know how to Pray and can accurately take it back to my Prayer Group?
Separation of church and state
You can search the Constitution and Declaration of Independence – there is nowhere that “separation of Church and State” is stated. It states that a State or Government Religion may not be established in order to protect our rights to religious freedom. Just saying… this is a counterfeit phrase that has been misused in many cases. Go to Jay Sekulow’s site for the American Center for Law and Justice – he has won countless cases against this statement.
Mark 12:17 – And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s. And they marvelled at him.
Romans 13:1-7 – Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. (Read More…)
Matthew 22:21 – They say unto him, Caesar’s. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.
Acts 5:29 – Then Peter and the [other] apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
John 18:36 – Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
1 John 5:19 – [And] we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
1 Peter 2:13-17 – Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; (Read More…)
Matthew 6:1-34 – Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven. (Read More…)
John 8:47 – He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear [them] not, because ye are not of God.
God I decree and declare that your supreme will is above the Supreme Court. Have your will and have your way Lord. We place all our trust in you.
Amen
I am really sorry to say this but the people must decide between GOD and satan now!
There are people that believe they are to be obeyed without qestion! These fools must be removed from power! I just pray we can do it without more blood shed!
They are killing people now and will not stop unless we stop them.
And we wonder why God is so angry. We need to let GOD BE GOD.
The government should not allow religious sects who want to murder non-believer or infidels to run a religious institution especially those who advocate taking over the country:
Socialism is a religion not just a form of government, mention the bible [It appears to be connected to world Ruler of Death & Rebellion-Slavery] baby murder under the Canaanite god Moloch, execution of old people Hindu goddess Kali, and murder of protestors satan himself: Prov 1:12-16
12 Let us swallow them up alive as does Sheol (the place of the dead), and whole, as those who go down into the pit [of the dead];
13 We shall find and take all kinds of precious goods [when our victims are put out of the way], we shall fill our houses with plunder;
14 Throw in your lot with us [they insist] and be a sworn brother and comrade; let us all have one purse in common–
15 My son, do not walk in the way with them; restrain your foot from their path;
16 For their feet run to evil, and they make haste to shed blood. Classic AMP
The nature is opposed to scripture: “If you don’t work you don’t eat,” but socialism says, “You work, I eat,” Kill the non-producers, Euthanasia.
Satan is on an ‘all fronts’ attack, going for the jugular! So what else is new?
Pull back far enough and you can see it’s insidious tentacles everywhere!
Body of Christ is an Army (Host) fighting powers unseen! As good soldiers come daily to the Lords Supper/Table, hear your orders, count the cost, then obey! No deviation! Only Father has the Battle Plan!
Today We Fight!
Free exercise of Religion…..In the Secret Place!
This matter is not the Supreme Courts matter. Freedom of Religion allows everyone the right to preach. Not only Christians but Muslims, Jews and other religions. It is not about money. This could cause people who talk about there religion not be able to talk to others. How many times have you heard someone say God bless you or say I’ll be praying for you. Parents won’t be able to talk religion to there children. Wether you get paid to teach religion or not paid. This Supreme Court decision. This can cause us to loose our rights of Freedom of Religion.
If the parents don’t want the kids indoctrinated to the teachings at the school, they should be able to remove the kids and send them to a different school.. Better yet, let them be home schooled.
I pray in the name of Jesus that there continue to be no government interference between church and state. Thank you Father you have heard my prayers. Amen.
The question remains…Why was the teacher laid off?
And who initiated supreme court involvement? I assume the teacher from the article.
Exactly what I couldn’t figure. If she was fired, what does that have to do with whether or not she’s a minister? Ministers get fired, too.
keep gov out if church business and they should concern who are trying to undermine our constitution and allowing the murder of babies and shelling of baby parts like nazies.
I wholeheartedly agree that the government has NO jurisdiction in this whatsoever. It is a testimony of an over-reaching government that has gotten too big for its britches. I pray against this tyrannical government right now in the mighty name of Jesus!!
I would submit that the root of the problem is allowing the government to have any authority at all in ANY church affairs. Most faith-based schools are an outreach of a church, and most churches these days are 501c3 status, which is a grave mistake. This makes the churches weak and powerless, as it then must bow to the state and not speak out on critical issues like abortion, sex-trafficking, political issues and world events that are leading to the beast system!! Wake up, church! Come out of her, My People!!
I pray right now for all huge awakening in the church and that you would open them eyes of your people, Lord! We are at the threshold!! Come quickly, Lord Jesus!!
Agreed! When we allow the government to have any say in what the body of Christ does, we’re allowing it to have power over us as believers, we give it the right to dictate how we worship.
Remember, give to the emperor what belongs to the emperor.
Amen. They have used this religious amendment in a twisted way. Insisting that religion has no place in society or marketplace when all along it was place there to protect us from government intrusion in religious institutions and matters.
I think parents should decide what their kids learn. You put them in a Catholic School you can expect them to learn to be Catholic; Same with a Baptist school. Chances are your kids will come out leaning towards the Baptist religion; same with a Jewish school and so on and on. If you have no choice but to send them to school in a Catholic or whatever school for whatever reason, then you need to explain to kids what they will be teaching them and although the basic principles may be like “ours” we however, do not believe in this and that and let’s talk about this daily if necessary.
And if you send them to a Public school they come out as a Communist!
Thanks for sharing this! I had no idea. Long term ramifications should they allow government to decide vs. those of faith.